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Facebook, which recently took down the elbow boobs picture, also took down this picture by men’s magazine Zoo. The crass post asks Facebook users if they’re a boobs or butt guy, with a “clever” picture.
The reason the picture was taken down was because:
“The image, disturbing nature of having a disembodied woman and the offensive, clearly sexist and even abusive nature of some responses on a page being used to advertise this product should not be allowed. Both the pictures, the questions that are posed and the responses are regularly demeaning and unacceptable to women. Women are objectified and sexualised.”
Which is true! But Zoo argues that because the Facebook post was ‘editorial’ material and not advertising, Facebook shouldn’t have a right to take down the post. Which is also true! Taking a look at Zoo’s Facebook page, every single post is demeaning to women. It’s their shtick. So why single one picture—even if its awfully demeaning—out? [BuzzFeed]
I think in the end the site belongs to Facebook and they can decide what they want on it. Regardless of whether we, as a society, agree with them or not.
Such as the furore over the mastectomy pictures or the baby breast feeding, which in my personal opinion was over the top and shouldn’t have been removed, but that’s Facebook’s choice and shouldn’t be forced to keep something which they don’t want. Put it on G+ or somewhere else that’s willing to accept such imagery.
May I highlight the fact that Facebook would not have a business model were it not for user generated content. So, sure, they can decide what they want and even go against society if they will, but if they alienate users they ultimately harm themselves.
I totally agree with you, but in the end that’s their decision to make. Other networks will happily step and and welcome people who want to post things like this and if Facebook aren’t too careful, they’ll lose their audience. But at the end of the day, that decision should be Facebook’s and no one elses’.
I could not agree more. Facebook can (and do) do whatever they like, it is our choice to use it or not and they are not the only available social network.
Left.
The whole facebook sexism thing makes me want to cry.
That’s some real mixed messages you’re sending there.
- Engagement with sexist question
- Ambiguous statement of your feelings over sexism
- Admission of non-stereotypically-masculing sensitivity.
What ARE you???
I can’t adequately convey my feelings on the subject here, but for clarification I am against it’s removal and I think the interpretation of sexism used to make it an issue is entirely misguided.
I’m definitely a boobs guy! I mean look at that top half!!
we cant even see if its a peachy arse though
I guess it could be badly interpreted as promoting sex and alcohol i.e. one of them is totally topless while the other is completely legless.
This opens up a huge debate. Is something that women get paid large sums of money for doing demeaning to women? Is something that preys upon the sexual urges of men not demeaning to men? I would argue that saying women can’t do this sort of work (or lapdancing or prostitution) IF THAT IS TRULY WHAT THEY WANT TO DO is restricting their choice of jobs just as much as saying they cant be firefighters or builders or boxers.
Yes, in an ideal world, men would not be being run from below the waist, but it isn’t and they are. If facebook calls this image demeaning to women, then every picture on facebook of someone flashing their boobs is too.
i think its demeaning to ugly women who cant earn thousands a day for looking pretty.
But does a woman who works as a scientist demean stupid women who couldn’t study nuclear physics?
Just because there is free and open objectification of women doesn’t mean it’s acceptable. If the world is the way you say it is then perhaps it’s about bloody time we changed it! Debates about modelling aside I draw the line at prostitution! Preventing women from becoming prostitutes is not sexism it is the protection of vulnerable women FORCED into such a despicable situation and abuse!
not all prossies are forced into it. of course over here its often alcoholics and heroin addicts or eastern european sex slaves.
abroad, say belgium and NL, they are sometimes just highly sexed people who can earn more in a day than their friends in a week.
Are they though!? How many young women do you know that say they want to be a prostitute when they grow up!? They are forced to make that choice for a variety of reasons, perhaps most notably as you point out due to the value of women in society working in ordinary professions.
Go back to your muesli and Guardian, of course there are women that choose to be prostitutes because of the money and they are no more forced than any other human being that is ‘forced’ to work for a living because our society requires money to buy things and survive.
What about the thousands of young women and men forced to do menial office and shop jobs just because they need money….start an outreach program for them.
Better the Guardian than Zoo Magazine!
Well thought out response, your persuasive argument has made me rethink my position entirely….not.
And how many women do you personally know in the sex industry?
For the record, I have known a few girls who claimed to want to be lap dancers and glamour models when they grew up. Prostitution is not that far a leap. And from talking to people in the fashion modelling business. I’d prefer my daughter (if I had one) to be a glamour model than a fashion model any day.
Agreed.. Some are forced. But that is only possible because of the illegal status in many countries. Girls who are controlled with an addiction or threat of violence. And it is 100% wrong, and really needs to be stopped. But sadly, it is a low status, low visibility crime, so not much attention is paid to it apart from a few vote seeking speeches, and TV chat show segments.
But..
In places where prostitution is legal, there is full legal protection, medical checks, and someone on hand in case a punter gets a bit too excited. Totally different scenario. In that case.. Yes. It is a choice, not a last resort. And people trafficking can not happen.
I don’t personally know any prostitutes, But I have known a few strippers over the years. All warm intelligent and strong women. Not neurotic traumatised broken dolls, who have been forced by abusive boyfriends, or do it to feed a drug habit. Such girls do exist, but I can’t see them lasting very long. They went into this with their eyes wide open, and they are the ones in control. Not the punter. They choose. And heaven help the guy who thinks they paid for more than they did.
You think a lap dancer cares about the guy who is paying through the nose for her to jiggle her bum in his face.. Nah.. She is playing the fool for every penny he has in him, and tomorrow, she will not even remember his face. She is the one in control. And she is very likely earning more in one night than he is in a month. And if he lays one finger on her, a bouncer is just a shout away. No matter how much he spent that night, he will eat pavement.
Prostitution is dangerous because it is underground. Just like the drug world. When you take away any legal protection, the scum start to move in, and things get scary.
Legalised, practitioners have the ability and the authority to say no, and someone to enforce that decision if need be.
Go to someone who is set up in such an environment, and she is not some poor girl fresh off the boat, and press ganged into this. She is a business woman who is selling a service.About as far from a victim as you can get.
I think it is terrible how men deem young women parading around in skimpy bikinis as a sexual objects, I see a young sexy woman in a bikini and skin cancer is on the forefront of my mind, look at the tits on that skin cancer.
But in all seriousness we are biological animals, and really what we are saying to men is feel emotions but don’t dare express them. The irony is all women want us to do is express ourselves, and when we do so honestly we get told not to express those emotions, they want faked emotion rather than real emotion. Really?
I suggest maybe they should stop defining us by their own limited terms at this stage. She thinks it is romantic when we hold hands, I give flowers or chocolates and so much other bull, I think it is romantic when she sucks my cock – but my thoughts and feelings don’t count, romance is dead to me
It seems to get harder in this post-feminist age, equality seems to now be more about defining what a man is than what a woman could become or should be, and nothing wrong with that if women are matching the historic achievements and legacy that man has solely reached without their input. Once they reach that point they have more than earned a right to define us – till then I can’t even understand why we give any time to such unbalanced progression. When they discover shit like electricity and computers then I guess they earned a right to piss on me daily, till then let’s aim for real equality, and not just a fucking token that we take on only when it suits our own interests.
The first huge unbalance is genetic theft, if anyone uses your genetic material to make a life without your knowledge, permission or consent then they should be imprisoned for a hell of a long time – I see that as a very serious issue that needs addressing to bring fore a more equal society – I can’t believe we live in a world where people get up in arms about mildly sexist material and we allow women to get away with genetic theft every fucking day – madness. Worst still this genetic thief can then lean on the man at a latter date to support a child he was refused knowledge of – sheer fucking lunacy – that woman should be locked up and we should throw away the key, and have the child taken from her as she is obviously unsuitable as a parent.
You clearly have a real problem with women! Please stay away from all women (although if they read your post above that won’t be a problem!)
I don’t have a problem with women, if you read what I am saying the problem is with a wider society defining men in limited terms and not striving to enforce equality -real equally that would help men and women work towards a better society, why are you denying us that? What is your agenda? Why do you have total disregard for genetic theft?
Why should I stay away from women? You don’t think their fragile brains can be challenged or cope with debate? I reckon they are more able than you give then credit for? And I find it wrong to demean them and undervalue them in this way.
On the whole I find that most women think that genetic theft should be a serious crime. Once you outline the fact, if a man in a white coat took your genetic material you make a life without your consent then it would be deemed as a serious crime within the law, then to suggest if a drunken woman does it that it should be overlooked within the law is pure craziness.
I have nothing against women but everything against deluded individuals like yourself. Genetic theft!? It’s hard to believe you are serious! Perhaps you should be more careful giving out your DNA in the first place! She isn’t going to be stealing it if you aren’t willing to freely give it.
Could you discover electricity or a computer?
I think men can protect themselves, but counting birth control pills and sweeping condoms for holes isn’t a good closer for that casual sexual encounter.
“Could you discover electricity or a computer?”
I can’t answer that hypothetical question and don’t understand why it needs an answer. The wider point is have you ever seen those kind of demeaning adverts that show a man unable to dial a programme into a washing machine, flip that advert to a woman unable to drive a car and it would be banned, and that’s the kind of equally that you defend. Nah. Are we suppose to find humour in that sexist ridicule because we all really know every component that goes into making a washing machine was likely invented by a man? That makes it OK?
I kinda think that men aren’t getting the full respect that they deserve right now. Look around you, that technology wonderscape that you live in is there for one reason only, men striving over 1000′s of years to do better. Otherwise we would be sitting in a cave sucking at our dick, which is the point in question. The result of everything a man has ever done is for sex, it is the focus and driving force of the male animal – to pass on that seed.
Achievement, wealth, discovery, invention, exploration, art, music, magic, etc, etc, it is all done for status. Who has the biggest dick? The reason this article was posted, the reason I posted a comment here is all about that, and your responses so much more apart of that. Look at the subtext, article with sexy abusive image of woman, and you post these words in response:
“You clearly have a real problem with women! Please stay away from all women (although if they read your post above that won’t be a problem!)”
The literal meaning of that is what it is! Not much subtext. You tell me I have a problem with women (women stay away from this man), you then tell me to stay away from all women (they are mine), and then tell all women how to judge me (stay away from him). That ain’t your freewill, that is your biology talking, it spotted a ticket to get laid. And nothing wrong with that, it’s rather healthy. The unhealthy part is denying what we are. I personally don’t want to think that as Einstein penned ‘E=mc2′ the back of his brain was thinking ‘I’m going to get some serious pussy with this shit’, but in all likelihood, being a human male with blood pumping it does strike me as a serious possibility.
I don’t know why we need to skirt around this issue, that me are deeply sexual animals, and that sexual reproduction is the main driving force driving everything we do. Read the comments and likes on this page, mostly in jest but sexual remarks. I am prepared to admit that I could be wrong about this, if this article wasn’t posted, if I never commented, if you never responded, if that is the reality then I hold my hands up, I am wrong.
Nice legs that lead to a nice bum over tits anyday.
Let’s test the limits here…
Left? good for blowjobs.
Right? perfect for a coffee table that follows you around.
And that is the limit of my sexim today. How exhausting to think like that…
I’m going back to demeaning my gadgets instead.
Android, you’re looking mighty fine today, let me root you and bring you back to stock, with a little sideloading action, and you’re perfect.
iPhone, let me just mount you into this fine dock and touch you all over.
Ooooh yeah. That’s it, I love the way your menus bounce when I finger you just right…
Hmmmmm. I’ll be in my bunk.